TOPIC: Beware Brightsides

If you ever think you might want a different finish on your boat, just beware Brightsides. Once it is on, the ONLY thing you can do is remove every last bit of it if you want a different paint or coating on your boat.

Brightsides is a funny coating. It can't be waxed or compounded. I sure wish I had known more about this paint before I jumped in based on expert advice. I know it comes out good for some people, but that sure hasn't been the case with me.

I am not happy with results on my Power Cat (over a number of applications) so want to go to an auto base coat/clear coat system. Interlux says there is nothing that they will recommend to encapsulate Brightsides so other coatings are not affected by it (I talked to a tech guy there just now). I.e., everything has to be sanded off.

So now I have to ask myself is it worth it? It might be.

Frank

Abrade the Brightside with 280-320 grade (grit) paper. and cover with Pre-Kote.....

Been using Brightside for years and never had a problem....re coated many times....... great as as bottom cover for trailer ed boats

www.wholesalemarine.com/blog/2008/02/24/how-to-apply-interlux-brightside-application-data/

www.yachtpaint.com/MPYACMDatasheets/Pre-Kote+eng+A4+Y+20100723.pdf

They will not tell you of shortcuts for it may come back on them and then cost the Co $$$$$

Are you saying I could abrade the Brightside surface, cover with Pre-kote, and then apply a base coat/clear coat automotive paint?

Frank

We re painted a 1974 22' sailboat over 12 years ago...still looks good...sitting in the hot TX sun near the coast

We sanded the Brightside covered with Pre-kote and cover again with Brightside

You may want to cover the Per-Kote with an auto primer before painting with an auto paint

Pre-Kote Preparation
PREVIOUSLY PAINTED SURFACES
In Good Condition Wash with a suitable detergent, rinse with fresh water and allow to dry. Abrade with 280-320 grade (grit) paper.In

Poor Condition Remove all previous coatings and prime the substrate.

Okay, so sand the Brightsides, cover with Pre-kote, then cover with something like a 2k urethane primer (catalyzed)?

I'm going to see if I can get an old boat for free (man, the boats I have given away!), and experiment a bit.

Thanks!

Frank

When you use a automotive primer always use a 2k urethane and not a lacquer base primer. PPG has a line of paints under the Omni brand. Their MP182 is a grey, heavy fill urethane primer that really does well. Jobber cost is about $65 a gallon and the hardner is about $43 a quart. It mixes 5:1. I know you work for napa, but if you have a dealer in town that sells PPG you should be able to get it at jobber cost.
Doug

Doug, Did you get my e-mail?? Joe

Dam Frank every time you say you done on this boat I see you are doing something to make more work for your self. At this rate it will never get done, Also everytime I see that your working on the boat you hurt your self. Now quit finding things wrong with the boat and take it out and have some fun.
Mike aka pathfinderz1

This will get done between seasons Mike. You know, we have seasons up here, even get snow once in a while...

Frank

Why can't it be waxed?

classicfins wrote:

When you use a automotive primer always use a 2k urethane and not a lacquer base primer. PPG has a line of paints under the Omni brand. Their MP182 is a grey, heavy fill urethane primer that really does well. Jobber cost is about $65 a gallon and the hardner is about $43 a quart. It mixes 5:1. I know you work for napa, but if you have a dealer in town that sells PPG you should be able to get it at jobber cost.
Doug

NAPA's 2k urethane primer is QT410 for the qt, comes with 8 oz of hardener (8oz411), and costs me less than 15 bucks Doug. I don't work for NAPA anymore (it's been years), but have an employee account that is tough to beat. Plus the guys that run NAPA's regional paint shop (both old paint pros) are old buddies, always there for me when I have questions.

Have you ever done a base coat/clear coat over Brightsides?

Thanks,

Frank

I got it and replied, but it looks like my email didn't send it. Now I can't get my email to send anything for some reason so I am sending you one from my Hotmail account in a few minutes.
Doug

JerrfyLube wrote:

Why can't it be waxed?

Most waxes slightly abrade the surface and that takes the shine off Brightsides. The way Brightsides works is as it dries all the shiny stuff rises to the top and hardens. That's it. Ya better like it because all you can do is put more on. Can't compound or wax it, takes that shiny stuff off the top and leaves you a dull surface. I sure wish I had known more about this stuff on the front end, but I didn't. It's probably just me, I'm picky. I figure I spend all this time on prep, the paint job should look good, and if it doesn't compound it and wax it. Not Brightsides.

Frank

PC1000 wrote:

JerrfyLube wrote:

Why can't it be waxed?

Most waxes slightly abrade the surface and that takes the shine off Brightsides. The way Brightsides works is as it dries all the shiny stuff rises to the top and hardens. That's it. Ya better like it because all you can do is put more on. Can't compound or wax it, takes that shiny stuff off the top and leaves you a dull surface. I sure wish I had known more about this stuff on the front end, but I didn't. It's probably just me, I'm picky. I figure I spend all this time on prep, the paint job should look good, and if it doesn't compound it and wax it. Not Brightsides.

Frank

Interesting...

Out of curiosity, have you actually tried waxing\compounding it or just going off manufacturer recommendations?

I only ask because I have contemplated using this stuff on my top deck on a boat that I will be doing later this year but that's a big "No way, Jose" if it can't be waxed.

frank, hate to see ya go thru this all over again. get a few quarts of petit easypoxy and take it to Maaco. for what your gunna spend in material, your labor, and a wait-and-see how it turns out scenario, you can have it sprayed and baked (you have to mask it off) for $700. ron

Awl Grip is much like this, great shine but hard to apply and work with for the amature.
When I did the Barracuda the White was done with Imron and the Coral is single stage eurathane, never clear coated
, just wet sanded and wheeled out with McGuires #85 diamond Cut Compound its
a ton of work, sand, sand, sand and buff, buff , buff but the results is attached.
JAG

Well, that's what I want John, something I can work with. Seems to me I saw you pushing a polishing rag not too long ago too...

Frank

I waxed my Norris and it has 3 coats of Brightside.... Made it look shinier actually... Not sure I believe the no-waxing hype on this..... I used Meguires paste....

Well, I'm the one that sold Frank on Brightsides. So, I feel somewhat responsible. But, Frank has so many layers of different brand paints, I'm not sure I should. And Ron, I hear your story, every time you tell the story of MAACO, and paying people to prep and spray your boat. But if you have never laid paint on yourself, I'm not sure you get a vote. I'm not going to get into a contest about this. But to lay down paint you need to know what you're doing. I have restored nearly 30 boats, every one of them using the same products and processes. You are not going to become a pro with one boat. You want to be pro on boat#1, well good luck with that. I am happy to help any one I can. JAG is right on. Awlgrip, the best of marine paints, requires a PhD in Chemistry to apply. So, I'm done. I love Brightsides. It's been a great paint for me. If you can't apply it, then study longer and harder, like I did.

I waxed the topsides of my ride that was done with Interlux Brightside,no problem.I also had a professional painter,[20+ years] touch up a few spots on the hull that was done with the same paint.His comments were this is a nice paint,a little thicker than"car" paint but it lays down real well and covers some [minor very minor] of the imperfections in the prep work. I bought the boat restored and we went over every thing that appeared to be done incorrectly.He also showed me how to make the paint pop when you lay it down.I thought mine looked good until we looked at what he had laid down,on the bottom of the boat compared to what the PO had done.He did blend it in perfectly,but looking at it from the right angle you can see the dif between a pro and a DYI. We did use the paint that came with the boat and that was 2 years old with the customary layer of hardened paint laying on the top..Air pressure,volume,amount of paint vs air,distance from surface are a few of the things that come into play.We are redoing the whole boat this fall and plan on using the same paint.As mentioned before so many times,it's all about prep,and in many cases experience in laying down paint, having a booth is a big plus as humidty and heat can also contribute to how it turns out. Now having said all this it probably would not hurt to try a few different brands and see if more comfortable with one brand vs the other. I know Marine Rustoleum has been mentioned as a easy to work with brand,maybe that is something to think about.Picasso could take watercolor and make it look factory good,I would take 500$ a quart paint and make it look like watercolor..I know my limits.

Well I'll throw my 2 cents in. i used Brightsides on the inside of the Clipper and I brushed it on! Gotta admit it went on great and looks good. Now i did mix nonskid for the floor and the sides are non smooth woven glass but the inside of the transom was smooth and it came out great with no brush marks believe it or not. I brushed it last summer in about 82 degree temp and moderate humidity inside the shed she lives in now. I used the recommended Pre-Kote also. Right now I'd use it again and probably either roll and tip or spray.

Bob

" if you have never laid paint on yourself, I'm not sure you get a vote. I'm not going to get into a contest about this. But to lay down paint you need to know what you're doing."

a vote for what??? your quote is exactly why i didn't do it myself and never would.i'm not as talented as many of you here. ron

crosbyboat wrote:

You are not going to become a pro with one boat.

I agree...painting like most things in life takes experience/trial and error....I would of never attempted to roll and tip a boat that I wanted to be a show boat or a "looker"...its hard to beat a spray finish unless you really know what ya doing with roll and tipping.

Well, good luck with Brightsides guys. Just remember, if you EVER want to change to something different, here is the list of your choices - ZERO.

When Brian says "Frank has so many layers of different brand paints" that is not quite true. After having bad luck with Brightsies to begin with, I tried Rustoleum's marine products. Never having done this, I mistakenly did not sand between coats of either the primer or the top side paint. Brian's comment then was that I had made a fatal error by using the "wrong" kind of paint, and I should use Brightsides. So back to Brightsides I went and had terrible reactions with the Rustoleum, so had to sand that all off and try again. Sprayed on or brushed on, Brightsides has just not worked out. My problem of course is that I want a decent finish on my boat, but can't afford to hire it done. Now, even if I want to hire it done, I'm screwed. Once you have used this product, you're done. It really just amazes me off, but so it goes. Something is going to change, if only because I love my boat.

Here's hoping things will be better in the future.

Frank

I've been less than impressed with any of the single part polyurethane paints that I've used. They CAN be great paints, if you understand their limitations and are OK with them, but I think that some expect too much from them.

They do not harden nearly as much as the multipart paints do in general... Which can be a mixed blessing. They generally are worthless when it comes to 'cut and buff'- I think it's just too soft. I've found that enamels, even Rust-oleum, seem to do better...

The softness is part of why you need to be careful what you apply over the top of them. But- when it comes to compatibility, I think you are ALWAYS better off if you stick with one type of paint system, mixing types and even brands is asking for trouble.

On my citation, I went out on a bit of a limb and tried a relatively new paint that I couldnt find much info on- Supermarine Revolution. Once I got the hang of it, I really loved the paint. It was easy to work with, went on well, and has retained great gloss. I cut and buffed it, and it shines like new gelcoat...

Applying paint is, in my opinion, one of the most difficult parts of a restoration. Painting is both an art and a science- Some can do it, some just can't. I decided to spray mine, and I did a LOT of practice first- I painted my trailer, the inside of the hull, and the undersides of the deck before I attempted to paint the parts of the boat that anyone would see... It worked out for me, even with my 'cheap' HVLP sprayer. I won't say it's perfect- There are some runs and drips here and there, but you DO have to look very closely to find them!

It is one of those things that takes a lot of practice, for sure... I have a much better compressor, and better spray equipment, so hopefully the next boat will be better. But- I plan to paint two more trailers and my truck first, just for practice!

-Andrew

It is one of those things that takes a lot of practice, for sure... I have a much better compressor, and better spray equipment, so hopefully the next boat will be better. But- I plan to paint two more trailers and my truck first, just for practice!

for professional spray results, best advice I can offer is this

lots of lighting & side lighting when you think you have enough, get another light in there, you need to be able to read the sheen of the last pass you made that it flowed into the previous pass.

before you start painting get a fair size piece of glass or sheet metal lean it up vertical,near the bottom of the glass spray a tack coat wait 10 -15 minutes and spray more coats till it runs, now you now at what point your paint runs

now move up on the glass and practice laying down a nice wet coat with no runs

WOW hate to get into a paint talk because people usaully get pissy .But So Here Goes ..Safety Safety Safety ...Some paints will KILL YOU ..If it has hardners and you dont have the right Equipment You can WAKE UP DEAD ..Isocrynates can not oniy be breathed in but get in threw your skin and eyes .They will Kill you or make your life Misserable for the rest of it .. Kinda like Ex Wifes only worse .So if you have a paint or primer that uses a hardner and dont have a spray booth with Air supply or One hell of a good resperator and know its limitaions DO NOT USE IT PERIOD .No paint job is worth your health or life .
With that said ..Most paints react because of the thinner thats in them . Read the can and see what its thinned with .If you put Base coat over rustoleum the rustoleum will soften and bubble .If you use a lacquer over enamel same thing .What ill tell you next I have seen done and done it myself was to spray a Epoxy Primer over enamels that have been properly prepped .Wet sand down to 400 .This is assuming that enamel has fully cured for at least 6 months . All you need is a thin coat to seal it .Then you can spray Urethane Primers over the Epoxy and block it out .From there you can use your BC/CC or a single stage urethane paint .Personally ild never put BC/CC on a boat unless its a trailer queen . Just scratchs to easy .Single stage Urethanes are great . Very hard paint and retains excellent gloss .Imron is a form of single stage .
Big Buck paint isnt always the best for project users . Often its less forgiven for the once in awhile guys .Often times you pay for its ability to dry faster and get more cars out the door .Production work .Often you pay for a name ..Be low is a link for some great paint at a very reasonable price . Ive sprayed alot of gallons of it and comes out real nice if you have good equipment ,Good prep and a little knowledge .

www.tcpglobal.com/RestorationShop/

They sell paints on Ebay for usaully $10 to $15 cheaper than on thier site .

But safety Dude ..You dont want your son driving his Dead fauthers boat ..Looks Great .. Too bad it killed him .By the way I worked in a body shop Way to long so I know what Im talking about .

great website and awesome colors. can auto paint be used below the waterline? ron

I don't think you'd want to use auto paint below the water line Ron. Imron might work, but I think auto paint on the bottom would only work for a show boat, not something you actually used in the water.

Frank

I've never used it. I've always used alkyd automotive enamel even under the waterline with great results. It's been durable. I use my boat for fishing and it does get scratched , dinged and drags the gravel. I've redone it 3 times over the last 12 years. Last time with black enamel. I liked it blue better but I had black. Right now at API I can get automotive enamel for $10.00 a gallon. When it is gone, it will be forever since they don't make it anymore. Color choices is not good. My truck was just painted last fall with it. I'm not saying what is better than what but you can do automotive all over. My cheap paint looks OK I think.

Imron can be used below the water line. I havea a friend who use to race sail boats and they painted their hulls with imron.

Bob

vuyosevich wrote:

great website and awesome colors. can auto paint be used below the waterline? ron

From what I understand it depends on what you do with the boat and what water your in .If your like me and dont leave your boat in the water there would not be a problem .If your boats in the water for extended periods of time or salt water the bottom side is suppose to be better .The little Critters in the water wont latch on so fast and foul the bottom .So if your boats not in the water for months Ya shouldnt have a problem .If bottom side is that much better why do guys have to repaint them every few years if left in the water ?? Ive sprayed a few boats for friends with Rustoleum including the bottoms .They still look good after quite a few years .They are the type of people that tow to the lake and get back out or maybe in the water a couple weeks on vacation .Rustoleum is actually some pretty good paint if your not in a hurry .If thinned and sprayed with some hardner you can lay out a excellent looking job . Heres a pic of my 1 ton Dually I sprayed with Rustoleum .I hadnt put it back together yet in this picture .Its been on there now for 5 years and still looks real nice .



Not to bad for a $45 paint job .

I ordered this gallon last week for $10.00. Check the receipt. This is a gallon. Same color as the truck.

Nice looking dually bobo!

Nice discussion on the paints...

Only thing I don't get is why Ron doesn't get a vote? If by vote you mean opinion, everyone is entitled to theirs. If you don't like it, don't listen to it.

I've painted quite a bit, but I still had my brother in law shoot mine, and yes, I did learn a few things. Practice, practice, practice...

Bo,
That's what I used for the Coral( 1957 Lincoln Coral) on the Barrracuda TCP's brand single stage eurathane. It went on as good or better that PPG or any other and wet sanded out and wheeled out beautifully! There bhelp line is super and I will use them again for sure.
JAG

I lucked out and got a test boat to play with. What I want to do is one patch pre-kote and brightsides, then one patch pre-kote, brightsides and pre-kote, then shoot both with a 2k urethane primer and see what happens. I get the boat Friday after work, and have no idea what it is other than it's an old 14' fiberglass boat.

Frank

Why bring the whole boat home

Go to a boat junk yard and cut out a piece...something like 12"X12"

For something like that if there is no power near a chain saw will do the job

PC1000 wrote:

Nice looking dually bobo!

Thanks PC . Found that truck in a Junk yard that was closeing I was looking for another Diesel .He was saveing the motor and tranny for his roole off but didnt need it anymore .It was badly rusted .Checked it out and it had $6000 worth of reciepts in glove box for new long block and rebuilt 5 speed pluss new tires .Had less than 3000 miles on her since work was done .He had died and the kids let it sit long time and then I wouldnt start .Called the bone yard .The Junk yard sold me it for $700 .
Heres the Old Box


Heres getting close to paint time .New mexico Fenders , doors and rebuilt cab corners .



Box Done


Cab painted



And ready for reassembly



Its set up to run on Free Used Veggy Oil .Cost me 13 cents a gallon and registered it for life with Collector plates ...L.O.L.. Its cheap to drive , Tows the crap out of my car trailer and will haul some serious Fire Wood ..It was painted With Rustoleum John Deere Green , Valspar Hardner , And thinned with Xytol or zeylene (( I probaully did spell that right ..L.O.L...) Menards in town has Many colors of Rustoeum and the lady is smart and will blend me custom colors so your no longer stuck with like 6 ..Ive painted a few cars with it and its held up well .Including this .







Just dont tell nobody my Baby is painted in Rustoleum please ...L.O.L..Thats 7 year old paint on the Camaro in the pictures .If its in sunlight you do need to Buff her out every couple of years . Keep a cover on it she stays pretty .Just about any paint will need a Buff to look top notch after a few years outside thow . So ya Rustoleum I like . I was nearly broke when I sprayed it with rustoleum But Im happy with it now ..

Awfully nice work Bobo, and what a deal on that dually! Good thing yer a handy fellow. I've always been a handy kind of guy too, but never have shot paint. I've done good over the years with rattle can painting, but am about to start with HVLP. 1st project is gonna be some adirondack chairs, then I have an old boat I'm picking up tomorrow just to practice painting with a gun. I'm gonna start with HVLP, but have an old standard gun too. we'll see how it goes. I'll probably be asking lots of questions soon!

Frank