TOPIC: FiberGlassics® is for sale.

First, I would like to thank Kelly for his pioneering efforts back in the day, yes, the day was 1998. It has been, and will continue to be a great ride. But like public TV and radio, that will take commitment from everyone. If the commitment isn't there, I suspect that eventually FG will fade away. I don't want that to happen. Nor do I have 5K to invest to own the site. And, the idea that Jamil tried to is most honorable, and I sincerely hope that he returns pronto. This is an opportunity, for all of us, to own a piece of history. Forget about advertising revenue, etc. for a moment, it's about ensuring Fiberglassics continues to exist. If Kelly wants 5K for the site, I think that is a more than fair price, and Jamil has paid for 10% of it, so holds a 10% stake, period.

I believe there are many out there who want to see the site continue. I would suggest, that with the lead Jamil put forth, we're looking for $4500 in contributions to Jamil or Kelly identified as "Site Purchase". Where that money should be commited or sent to, I don't know, but I am willing to coordinate it.

I hope you're getting the idea. 9 more people at $500 buys the site, and establishes the 10 "FG Trustees". If you can contribute $250 or $100, you're also in. It's an idea, but will take a lot of effort from others. I am not a programmer. I am a visionary, and I see this, like public radio, working, if we all support it. If we don't, it won't. And no one will be to blame, but us.

To all who believe in what Kelly has invested so much in, think about it, and post here if you can commit.

come on FGNE...john gibson and i are in. still have to hear from houston, cc1000,pc1000,tim c., jim sgrig, jim bart, g3 jim,todd, or anyone else. the only thing that scares me is the 10 different opinions with that many owners. ron

This is not about any one locale, and reference to such concerns me. A joint venture is just that, a joint venture. To be successful we need everyone. If we can do this, the govenerning rules would need to be laid out, same as any other organization. It's not that hard, but will take an organizing committee, and a group of people with authority to make decisions. ACBS or any other organization is no different.

It takes 10 at 500 or 20 at 250 to do this. But more than that, it takes the committment that Jamil and others have shown for the long haul. It's the long haul that worries me most.

Ron and John - Ron, you said you and John are in, so I understand, each of you are in for $500, $250, other amount. Let me know.

we're in for the monthly payment of $50 each. not a lump sum. jamil was on a payment plan. i assume that is still acceptable.

I like the 50 month per person plan. As noted with 10 or 20 people it is very reasonable and gets paid of in less than a year.Any one have a paypal acct or would we have a treasurer that would handle checks. I just need a little more info before I jump on board.

Already getting too complicated. A sale should be executed short term, not terms of 10-12 months. Too many options for default of one or more people the longer the term. There is a lot to do and understand as far as what buying FG entails. Hate to say it, but maybe even a lawyer should look over the deal.

this was exactly the downfall of "project 2011' ..as soon as someone mentioned ATTORNEY/LAWYER consideration, it got way too complicated.

I can make a small contribution I would be into it and have thought of it if 10 or so guys chipped in. I live here daily I want to see it go on. I doubt is will ever be a profitable venture I do not think it was designed for that so to be a token owner for the benefit of the site living on I am cool. I am sure whatever income there is goes to maintain the site. Maybe all interested parties need have a better understanding on what it takes to keep the site up and running. I need a week or two to fess up coming out of this winter but I am in for 100 maybe 250. I suppose more discussion needs to take place but I do not think anything should be over thought......
Jim (G3Jim that is)

Very interested. Someone email me or talk to me on this project. Willing to get into it as we need to keep this site and its base root meaning going. It would be a shame to have someone a year down the road try to look up the site and find it gone the way so many other sites have gone.Lets just have fun with it and keep it under the "kiss" rule.That way no one gets hurt or will feel that they are being left behind. Thankyou Skip.

A lawyer's thoughts would be very helpful in dealing mainly with the registered trade mark Kelly owns, FiberGlassics. Does that come with the site's purchase, and if so how and to whom is it transferred? If not, what does that mean for the long term? That is about the most valuable tangible the site owns.

There's also PayPal accounts that need to be transferred to a new entity. Any time money is involved with a group of people, there needs to be accounting and oversight.

Beyond that, I think it's very important for the buyer(s)to understand monthly costs for keeping the site running, and the amount of administrative and computer programming needed. Because we kick in $50 a month for 10 months doesn't make the site run. Making the site run takes time, effort, and money. Who is doing the work and paying the fees during a 10 month purchase period? It all needs to be worked out.

This is a business deal and you can't go into it half cocked. Lets keep talking and sharing opinions. No ones right or wrong with opinions.

hi brian,before you posted this i asked kelly about a few of us getting together and buying it ,with payments,and he said he wasnt interested in it,have you asked kelly?john

I would be willing to put in $250 toward the purchase to see the site continue on I can not forsee the ability or time to work on any of it other than enjoying the community and knowledge base we have here. If such a purchase occuse the NE group can contact me for a contribution.
Thanks
Jesse

I agree with the NPR stance of we have to support oiur community.

I would be willing to put in if it sounds like we could get it rolling. I could put in $100 or $250 maybe. This is a fantastic site with a wealth of knowledge, too much to just let slip down the ways.

It looks like a managable feat to have dedicated "members" contributing $100 to fund the purchase. [50 members at $100 = $5000].
In the same way I was a "5 yr. paid member" before, I am certainly willing to offer another $100 now to keep this site and forum up and running. I'm not interested in becoming an owner, just want to be an active member.
If that is how its going to work, I suggest something official in the way of dedicated thread with specifics.

Agreed. Pass the proverbial hat, sign the site over to Jamil (who would be a great caretaker in MHO) and call it a five year Gold Sponsor membership fee.

No I didn't John, and if I were Kelly I wouldn't want to string a sale out for almost a year, either and needing to count on 20 or more people funneling pocket change every month to him. What I was suggesting was money up front from 10-20 people, and buy the place outright. Sounds easy, it isn't.

brian,i sent in 50 bucks last year anyhow,ill try for 100 this year,if i can ill try for more,ill give whenever i can.this site and you folks mean alot to me.
and i know it wont be easy ,but its worth a shot,john

cawrsfm wrote:

Agreed. Pass the proverbial hat, sign the site over to Jamil (who would be a great caretaker in MHO) and call it a five year Gold Sponsor membership fee.

I'm in for $100.

Jamil looked like he was doing a great job. The enthusiasm and knowledge was there. Just short on cash and I'll make a small contribution to that.

Stringing out a sale for a year is better than no sale. Everyone is entitled to there opinion[about whether he would string it out] and unless somone ask the question it's a moot point.I sell tools for a living and 98% of my sales are because I hold the note.Generally speaking you are looking for a 10-15 week turn on your money.This is a bigger ticket item,like a used car, and would require more time.If you get a downpayment and hold the title it's not a bad position to be in.If the party bails out on payments,they lose that money, you take back the item,then resell it.You could go back to the original price or discount the payments made.Either way your ahead.
Having said that, yes, it would be better to put down as much as possible and get it over with. The current economy seems to be dictating a different approach/solution..........JT

i agree that jamil and his team were doing a great job,lets try to get them all back in the saddle again,ill email him,john

It seems like we all have a lot of faith in Jamil and the board of directors already established. So maybe instead of funneling small amounts to FG and we never know how much, instead maybe it should go to an account set up to buy FG, and when there's $4500 in it, whamo, it's given to Kelly, and the site ownership is transferred. Best to have one or two people hold the account, and another provide accounting oversite. Maybe PayPal?

So what does it take to run this site on a monthly basis? Money first and then effort to keep it going?

Can advertisers fund the money portion?

Are there enough volunteers with web maintenance experience to keep it running? Would the new owners need to hire someone for this?

Advertising dollars, or a monthly membership fee would help to deferr those costs. Lots of questions AFTER the initial purchase need to be addressed.

I love this site. It's a piece of history, it needs to be preserved.

Having gone off to do a video site and not participating at FG for quite a few years, I don't know the current batch of boarders - but I sure see a lot of great expertise when I stop by.
I think I can help a bit with your dilema. The minimum requirement would be an eskrow fund toward purchase with Kelly as co-signer. The better way to proceed would be to incorporate. Public Television was forced to do it some time back. There's private corporations and when qualified, public corporations. You can apply for a not for profit status which allows you to pay officers for performing services for the corporation. Again, profit is optional. All income can be rolled back into the operation. This stuff is done everyday by housewives selling granola on line. Not really a big deal and the legal fees should be small. Look for a pro-bono through friends. Kelly had the foresight to copyright his title which is a legal committment. Any site buyers should really not be scared by minimal legalities. I'm not a lawyer and do not play one on TV. One of my best friends is a lawyer but he's so rich I never hear from him except Christmas.

The going price these days for an online site server account is about $50 per year. The domain registration about $10/yr. Discussion boards are available for free. ( I put one up temporarily at another site but everyone just uses this one or one of the other spin-off boards )

The real investment, as Kelly and I have discussed years ago, is TIME. Time daily to look for trash on the board, time to add new content, manage existing content and correspond with contributors, advertisers etc etc etc etc etc etc. etc etc etc Well maybe you get it now.

So, if Jamil is willing to do the time, you guys should form a private corporation, start an eskrow account, apply for not-for-profit status. Pay Jamil anything you get beyond costs for site maintenance and development. Set up a private discussion board for this kind of stuff and get on with becoming the next ACBS.

i havent heard from jamil yet,we might want to look at other people too .for the job of heading this up,john

I did like the changed that Jamil had started and the more active approach. Hopefully John will be able to get back in touch with him. That being said the non-profit approach with board members etc may be the path to take. Also as far as the legal issues go there are "legal aid" services which are far cheaper than a lawyer to draft documents, etc. As there is nothing to actually go to court and argue over the cost should be minimal. Just a thought.

Without response from Kelly and/or Jamil this thread is interesting but moot.

A quick look at GlassClownBoats.Com shows that Jamil would appear to be busy building his own site. Without the kind of enthusiast and profit motivated drive that he brought to FG how will the energy be restored? Look at what's happened since his deal fell through...the forum is back to CL notices and the front page hasn't changed since the first of March.

Advertisers? Who are they? I don't know what if any effort Kelly put into selling advertising but look at what's here now. Then think about who would pay to be here. What businesses benefit from this audience? Where have you spent money on boat related items in the past 6 months? Anywhere? Anywhere that would need FG exposure to get you to spend that money?

I've had an ad here for the hubcaps for a long time. I've sold a few pair as a result but my advertising dollar is far better spent on Ebay.

Then there's the issue of who controls things. Who will make the committment to spend all of the time and energy to do what Jamil had been doing? Who will keep the thing running? Ken has been working for free since the FG v2 came online. That's hardly fair. There are and will be expenses. People need to be paid for what they do - especially when the time spent is as substantial as his.

There will be legal costs. There needs to be legal costs. Legal Aid is for indigents. Hobbyists with their classic boats get to pay their own way.

But back to the original premise - nowhere in here is a comment from Kelly or Jamil.

The legal aid I am speaking of is not the free help that you may be thinking of. These people specialize in typing documents and making sure these documents are legal. Many lawyers simply sub out their work to these people, (para-legals). All I was trying to say is why pay a lawyer over $150 an hour when a para-legal can do the same work for 1/3 the cost or less. Your point about finding an individual or group of individuals to run Fiberglassics needs to be the first concern.

i have jamils email ,because he was talking to me about being in the member spotlight,so i think its his personal email,i will try again to get him to answer and maybe he will take the lead in this venture,john

The best piece of business advice I ever heard:

Plan your divorce before you get married

crosbyboat wrote:

It seems like we all have a lot of faith in Jamil and the board of directors already established. So maybe instead of funneling small amounts to FG and we never know how much, instead maybe it should go to an account set up to buy FG, and when there's $4500 in it, whamo, it's given to Kelly, and the site ownership is transferred. Best to have one or two people hold the account, and another provide accounting oversite. Maybe PayPal?

here a shocker, I agree with you but as always to a point. This does sound logical but without having "active-management" it would be like trying to drowned a fish underwater.

am I having some kind of dashavue, hasn't this happen before?

Peter_Crowl wrote:

A quick look at GlassClownBoats.Com

Well, it says it down for maintenance, so for anyone who wants to see where I been "hanging" and since it seems to be ok sharing website information...

The Boaters
www.theboaters.com/

Maybe we can pitch them a purchase for fiber, they could use some fodder for their library after they dismantle it and rip the guts out of it.

why try drowning the fish, when you can just smash it's head on a rock, gut it and toss it on the shore. Sure does beat putting it on a stringer waiting for it's eventual death anyways.

heres another shocker...i'm shocked you said that. lolol again.. the more complicated it gets the more disilusionned i am. i'm surprised i haven't heard none of this legal stuff when i do the calendars every year. ...... :lol

well ron, I am shock myself, of course being the one holding the fork in the wall outlet, I am not surprised.

i just got an email from jamil,and he said after the new owner or owners take over he will partisipate in any way they see fit ,and will help out,john

wish i had a job and money i could use to buy this but ijust dont. this sites really helpful cant let it just not happen im sure everything will work out hopefully.

Brian, put me down for $100. (It may take several weeks to scrape it together, you have my email, just let me know when you find out.) I sincerely wish it could be more, and if it comes down to it, I'll try to sell my project boat and donate whatever proceeds are derived to help try to keep this site alive!

This place is a priceless resource for our "hobby', as well as a familiar common ground for a large family of like minded enthusiasts. I can't imagine where I'd be without the info and guidance that has been provided here. Are there realities that need to be addressed: sure. Are there legal issues that should be addressed: sure. Is it going to be easy: probably not, but well worth the effort, and THANK YOU for spearheading the project. Are the problems so severe they can't be overcome if given the proper attention: I certainly hope not.

Reality checks, positive suggestions for assisting in the success of the project, and pledges to contribute should be welcomed. Negativity, talk of past failures, dialogue about gutting the site of it's resources, and other "dead fish" euphemisms......... (I'll stop here, I think you all get the point.)

I see two issues.

One: The cost to purchase the site from the present owner.

Two: The cost, time and procedures to do the day to day tasks required to keep the information flowing through the site.

The first issue should be able to be resolved by reasonable people.

Would an option for the second issue be the formation of a nonprofit organization to sponser the website? Funding would be by the collection of membership dues.

Just a thought.

Randy

I would have to agree with the concept of membership dues. I believe in the end it will be the only way to pay the bills and compensate for time involved for anyone/all who inherit this site.

Why not set up an association chapters and dues?

Just my .02

CD

I've noticed some good remarks. Can't help but mention they echo what I said in my earlier post.

"Why not dues?"

"Well, you shouldn't sing the blues unless you've paid your dues."

People still expect everything on the web to be free. Dues will save fiberglassics but not fiberglassics.com As I said 8 years ago. There needs to be a real world organization to justify this website.
Call a convention. Follow established club parliamentary rules or forget the whole thing. $10 X 1000 = $10,000 Enough to buy it and pay organiztion fees. Setup a private board for members to comment and vote about the formation of the Organization. Trim the current site to a minimum of functionality with a statement about the evolving host organiztion and an invitation to join for $10. An account will need to be opened in the name of Fiberglassics by a lawyer/trustee until the new virtual board of directors and treasurer are elected. It's called a Club you guys.