TOPIC: 1964 Evinrude Sport 16

Hey Guys,

Brand new member here. I recently came into a 64 Evinrude sport 16 with what appears to be the original motor, starflite 75 hp electric shift. Anyway, I bought it as a small project. The guy who sold it to me assured me that it was ready to go and just could use some paint and a little interior work. Well, my little project has turned bigger, like all my projects seem to do.

The boat is in not in fact ready for use. It ran at the former sellers place, so I figured it was ok. I was wrong.

When I got it home it failed to start, so I changed out all the plugs and cleaned the carb and after about an hour of tinkering it finally fired up only to find that the propeller doesn't turn. So, I figured it either was spun or the electronic shift was buggered somewhere. Then, I noticed that the starflite leaves an excessive amount of oil in the bucket I tested it in. The water went from crystal to black in less than a minute. I figured it was just bad fuel to oil mixture, so I changed out the water and mixed new fuel and it is just as bad. Tried it a few different times thinking it just needed to be run a bit after it was winterized maybe. No dice. The thing just hemorrhages unburned fuel, and I am not sure I dare take it out because of this.

So, to shorten this story i was wondering if all old motors are like this and is there anywhere that sells old boat parts online. I am having a helluva time finding anything for the boat.

Thanks,
Jeff

Hopefully here is a photo of it

well without seeing it and how the oil looks in the water.. i'd check to see the condition of the gear oil in the lower unit.. the electric shift motors take a special lube in them... but these older motors are known for not being so Eco friendly..and dumping lots of extra fuel and oil out the exaust

I changed the gear oil first thing and it looked to be about the same vintage as the motor. The water in the bucket looks just like the oil you get when you change the oil in your car. I am going to try and get a few different types of oil and see if that may help.

A 75hp V4 OMC of that vintage will turn the water oily in about 3 seconds flat! When the motor is running at idle and cold it's dumping raw fuel mix down the leg at an alarming rate. When it's in the lake it's not nearly as bad but there will be a sheen left behind for sure. On the upside if it runs well the motors are just about bullet proof. The lower units not so much if any water can get into them. Make sure the seals are all good and that you search out OMC type C lube. If you need to do any work on the electric shift LU get yourself a manual before you even attempt to open it up as it is a different beast for sure. Most often the problem with shifting is in the control unit where a switch is not making proper contact. When the motor is in neutral there is energy going to the magnets holding the gears out normally when things go wrong the motor is stuck in forward as the springs hold things in so you can get home with a malfunctioning control or LU. Take it to the local lake and give it a try, you'll know quickly if there is a problem.

Thanks Al, the seals all looked pretty good when i changed out the gear oil. I did use the type c. Out on the lake it would rev up but no movement. Tried reverse too, and still nothing. I plan on looking at control unit and wiring tomorrow. I am hoping it is just a broken wire or something. Maybe it is even a spun hub, but I am not getting anything when i shift into gear. Seems like I would hear a click or feel a lurch or something.

Actually, on the old Selectric electric shift models like this 75hp V4, the spring has to be magnetized by its solenoid in order to hold a gear. With no power, the L/U will always be in "neutral".

Later Hydro-electric L/U's had an oil pump & spring-loaded fwd gear which was always in Fwd with no power. Power to the L/U solenoid(s) either pumped the shift clutch into Neutral or Reverse, with engine rotation providing motive force for the hyd. pump.

I have some very distinct memories of being out fishing with my Dad in his new '64 Glasspar Avalon with a 60HP Selectric V4, when the Fwd gear spring broke. My Dad had to back the boat all the way to the boat ramp while my Uncle and I sat on the bow to keep the backwash from pouring over the transom!

Totally agree with the oily discharge, though. Those old 2-bbl downdraft carbs probably shunted about half the fuel/oil mix out the bottom of the motor. Or at least it seems like that much!

Very telling when the same engine displacement, with 4-bbl flow-thru carbs & manifold, made another 15 to 25 hp on later models, and did a lot better on fuel. The 75's were just that inefficient.

Anyway, as long as the carb isn't dumping fuel from a leaky float needle/seat, or ruptured fuel pump diaphragm, it's just normal "drooling".

Cheers......ed

Perrea90 wrote:

Thanks Al, the seals all looked pretty good when i changed out the gear oil. I did use the type c. Out on the lake it would rev up but no movement. Tried reverse too, and still nothing. I plan on looking at control unit and wiring tomorrow. I am hoping it is just a broken wire or something. Maybe it is even a spun hub, but I am not getting anything when i shift into gear. Seems like I would hear a click or feel a lurch or something.

HI, Jeff, the blue wire to the L/U gets powered-up for Reverse and the Green wire for Forward. The way I always remember is "Green" for "Go" and "Blue" for "Back".

If you trace the wiring inside the engine cover, you should see the blue and green electric shift wires on located on the Starboard side, routed along the lower cowling. They connect to the shift cable, which will be sticking out of a penetration in the exhaust tower.

Once you find the connection points, you'll see each one is covered by a rubber sleeve. Pull the sleeve back and you'll see the spade connections that can be taken apart.

Take your battery charger and hook the Neg lead of charger to a good engine ground. Connect the Pos clamp to either blue or green wire leading to the lower unit.

Turn the charger on and attempt to rotate the prop by hand (for safety's sake, pull the plug wires before this test). The prop will spin in one direction, and lock in the other. If it spins both ways, the clutch spring is likely broken. Go the the other wire and repeat the test.

Another test you can do is to power-up both wires at the same time. This energizes both solenoids and completely locks up the propshaft. If it does turn in any direction when you do this, it's another indication that a spring is busted in the L/U.

Whatever you do, DO NOT attempt to run the engine with those 2 wires energized at the same time, something's gonna break!

Hopefully it's just an issue with the control box or wiring back to the motor (very common), and not a problem with the bottom end. They ain't fun to work on fer sure!!!

Check out these parts diagrams, might not be your exact model but this is for a '64 Selectric so the parts will be the same:

www.marineengine.com/parts/johnson-evinrude-parts.php?year=1964&hp=75&model=75492

Hope that helps, let us know what you find.......ed

Thanks guys for the responses. I am going to tinker with it a little more today, and I will definitely let you know how it goes. Probably just frayed wires...I hope anyway.

Welcome aboard Jeff, glad to have you join us. As you can see you've gotten excellent advise from the gang, hope everything works out for you.

Not to start the "which outboard oil is better" debate again, but I've found that the full synthetic two stroke oil does smoke a little less. As the gang stated that ole girl is gonna smoke some, but this might help. It will also be much less noticeable out on the lake (or river) once the motor cleans itself out. Running it in the barrel the motor has no chance to do this, and the smoke is right there "in your face" instead of having a breeze to carry it away.

Just my two cents, keep us posted on your progress.

Well, it has been awhile. I have tried and tried to get this motor running, and no matter what I did it just wasn't working, so I ended up buying an 1985 yamaha 50hp motor. This motor works like a charm. No sheen and everything is clean. We took the old girl out and chatted with a few people while out on the water, and the general consensus is it is almost unamerican to put a yamaha on this piece of Americana. Oh well. The other thing I noticed is the hull is full of water and leaking through a couple spots. I took it to a couple fiber glass guys and the quotes are pretty pricey. This is quickly becoming a much larger project than I anticipated.

Patching fiberglass is a DIY'ers easy smeazy project. Post up some pics of the areas needing repair and we can help you thru the process.

Hi Flamingo,

I was figuring it might be a fairly easy job, but getting the water out is kicking my butt, and my wife doesn't want me grinding away at the hull because of the lead paint being around our little ones. Anyway, I started out by drilling a 1" hole in the floor near the plug to hopefully get the water to drain from the hull and out the plug. I was really surprised it didn't have a way to drain the hull. The foam is really slowing the drainage though. After I get it drained I was thinking of taking it somewhere to do the grinding and cleaning away from kiddos. There are five or six spots running down the keel where the water is coming out. And the big problem is there are a lot of holes in the floor I didn't know about until now. I think I may end up cutting some 1/4" ply to fit the floor and then lay glue it over the top of the existing floor and cover it all with some non-slip material or something.

here is another spot

Ok, the Floor/Deck of the interior of the boat needs to be totally removed to expose the stringers, bulkheads and foam that are below. Then all of that will need to be ripped out and removed all the way down to the glass hull. I'm guessing the transom at the rear of the boat will also need to be removed and replaced as well. I seriously doubt that there is any "Lead" based paint in your boat. I wouldn't worry about that but...You do need to wear the proper PPE anytime you're working on the boat because fiberglass and any dust is NOT healthy to be breathing for anyone!!! I highly recommend a full cover Tyvek suit and a full face respirator. Also if you dust yourself down with baby powder every time before you do any Fiberglass sanding or grinding it'll really help keep the "Itch" off!!!

I'm really not sure what I'm looking at in the pics you posted. Close ups are good in some cases but backing off to give a bigger perspective is also helpful at times. Normal construction on boats of this vintage is kinda like this drawing...

I truly believe your boat is going to require a total rebuild in order for it to be seaworthy. I believe the foam, below the deck is totally water saturated, and will need to be removed and replaced. It cannot be dried out. It is adding Hundreds of lbs of additional weight to the boat and has rotted out the substructure of the boat and this structure is critical to the overall safety of the boat. IMHO to do this job correctly you'll be looking at approximately 100-200 man hours of work and about $1,500 to $2,500 in expenses depending on how much damage you actually find once you get all the demolition done

Thanks flamingo! The photos I added were of the keel on the center hull. I am in the process of draining it out now, which is taking forever because the foam is refusing to let it go, and I am thinking this is above my means. I am just not prepared to rip the floor out and the foam and the stringers, which I think are beginning to rot. The transom seems clean on a positive note. I drilled into it and got nice bright shavings, but this is proving to be above me. I was thinking of throwing to caution to the wind and doing a band aid patch, but I live on Lake O. No way I am taking it out with out a real repair being done. Would be different if I had any skills and/or a place I could work away on it until I developed the skills.

Yeah, the waterlogged foam can add Hundreds of lbs of weight to the boat and make her unsafe. I'd not feel safe in her.

Perrea90,

WELCOME ABOARD.

IF it was my boat:
1. I'd replace that 50HP Yamaha with a suitable 55HP HOMELITE 4-cycle. = Those are "around" for a reasonable price, are cheap to run & relatively easy to work on yourself.
(Complete factory repair/parts manuals for all the HOMLITE/BEARCAT OBs are available on DVD on ebay.com for CHEAP. = I paid 5.oo for mine.)
and
2. I'd "pop the deck off" & rip out all the water-logged foam & all the wood from stem to stern, replace the foam & all the wood. - Then refinish the boat. = After that, it will be good for another half-century of use.
(This is a time-consuming job but NOT too expensive IF you do the work yourself.)

just my OPINIONS, satx

Yeah. I kind of knew it would require a ton of work once I saw the drips. I am just not confident I could do it all without having a garage or even a car port to work on it in. I have been brainstorming on how to get to the hull the easiest way, and I came up with a way similar to what Satx suggested. Maybe just removing the motor and rub rail and cutting the deck off and using a pulley to lift it up and off completely, but again the reality of the situation is I probably will never finish a job that is that big. Thank you again guys for the suggestions and help. Now, I have to decide if I keep her with the hopes of eventually fixing her up, or do I list her so someone else can fix her up and get her on the water?

my suggestion ..forget about boating until you have the cash to buy a seaworthy boat...and then you won't really know if its good without having the experience. i thot i bought the perfect boat and paid $3500.00 for it. i'm into it now $11,000 because i wanted it showorthy..the majority of that, labor paid out because i didn't know my ass from my elbow. ron

Hey Ron, thanks for the suggestion...a lot of this boating thing is just cost benefit analysis. If dropping 11K brings you 11k's amount of joy, good on you! I, on the other hand, would have just as much fun going back to the aluminum boats I am accustomed to for less than that amount of money. I only bought this sport 16 because it was there, and I thought it would be neat to own a little bit of American history, and I was right. It is, but there comes a point when it just doesn't make sense financially to continue to dump money into a project. Sure, I could dump the estimated 6k-10k to have somebody fix it up for me, but I could have fun in another boat for less. Besides, if I made the boat all pretty and safe I would probably turn into one of those guys at the car shows I laugh at that trailer their cars to the shows. What good is a car you don't drive?

Perrea90,

Otoh, you COULD have a Manta Ray like REMEMBER WHEN, that truthfully I think one of the prettiest runabouts that I've seen in >50 years of boating.

ImVho, 11,000.oo is CHEAP, considering what a fairly "plain jane" boat/motor/trailer costs NEW these days.

just my OPINION, satx

Perrea90 wrote:

Hey Ron, thanks for the suggestion...a lot of this boating thing is just cost benefit analysis. If dropping 11K brings you 11k's amount of joy, good on you! I, on the other hand, would have just as much fun going back to the aluminum boats I am accustomed to for less than that amount of money. I only bought this sport 16 because it was there, and I thought it would be neat to own a little bit of American history, and I was right. It is, but there comes a point when it just doesn't make sense financially to continue to dump money into a project. Sure, I could dump the estimated 6k-10k to have somebody fix it up for me, but I could have fun in another boat for less. Besides, if I made the boat all pretty and safe I would probably turn into one of those guys at the car shows I laugh at that trailer their cars to the shows. What good is a car you don't drive?

:

I'VE PRETTY MUCH FALLEN INTO YOUR LAST SENTENCE...sadly

Perrea90,
If you look at the big picture, yes it is overwhelming. But if you look at little pieces along the way, it shouldn't be bad.

I have the attitude with my broken boat, that if I break it a little more? It's still broken, so there is no big loss ! BUT this is where all the help comes from this forum.
I have not done any fiberglass work period.... YET !!! But this forum is taking a lot of fear out of the process. As soon as I get a few more honey-do brownie points, I'm going to dig into it hard.
Will I make mistakes ? Yes I will. But when I hit a jam, I'm banking that the folks here will help you out of the jam.
I know as soon as I succeed at the first little piece of the big picture? I'll be hooked ! Heck, the first thing I built, to get ready was my boat flipper.
Don't fear your lack ability ? You'll never learn if you don't try ?
Just my opinion....

Chuck in Cincinnati,

WELL SAID.

yours, satx

If I could physically do the work myself I would, and knowing that I can't is a hard thing to acknowledge. I can chip away at a lot of things and do little cosmetic repairs, but, unfortunately, anything big I would have to pay someone else to do because I really just can't physically do a lot of things anymore. I only have one arm to work with consistently because of a deteriorating neurological condition and, although it would be gratifying to pick away at this, it would also probably speed along my deterioration, and I would probably never get a chance to finish it or use it. Yes, I agree satx $11,000 is pretty cheap and would get you a nice little Jon Boat with no trailer or motor or anything if it was new, but you can get a pretty decent used boat for that, and Ron's boat is a beauty, but, like I said, my clumsy butt would be afraid to take that out. I'd be sure to find the one rock in the water and scar the boat.

Well, I have been thinking and thinking on what you guys have been telling me, and I might be a little too hasty in deciding to find the boat a new owner. To hell with the idea that the boat isn't worth the money it will take. I am thinking I might give the repair a try myself because it isn't like I can really screw it up any more. Now, I don't have a lot of tools, but I have some pulleys rope and a tractor, and I was thinking instead of cutting the floor out, I might try removing the rub rail and then separating the top from the bottom of the boat by tying lines on each cleat and then using the tractor and pulley to lift it off. I am not sure if this will work or not, but it is worth a try once the weather clears up. Then, once I can see down in there I will have a pretty good idea on what needs to be done. This should be interesting...

THAT'S the spirit we like to hear around here! All of us had a "first time" at this stuff, and few of us have all the tools and facility we'd like to have at our disposal. But we help each other learn, and make due with what we have to work with. You get the "atta boy" award for the week Perrea90, we're proud of you!

Shot pics and don't be afraid to ask questions, we're all here for you and glad to help any way we can.

Had a Crestliner that was giving me a lot of grief pulling the top, here's how I solved the problem. Jacked it up and put 2x4's under it and then just shoved it off to the ground to deal with later.

Great idea sabre! I was just out trying to figure out what the hell I was going to do, and using car jacks is a good, easy thing to try. Now, I just have to get the wife and kids on board.