TOPIC: 1974 Marlin with 1971 Merc 1350

Smart move, no reason to push luck.
Are u going to be home this evening?

Nope - moving in Appleton the next few days.

Trying to get my ducks in a row for Sunday - what type of fluid should I buy for the T&T? Tranny fluid?

Another question - are the Merc's picky about lower unit lube? I was thinking of changing the lube on them, and was going to see if I could find a gallon or two of oil and a transfer pump. Just wasn't sure if there was a difference between the tastes of Mercs and Johnnyrudes for gear oil. If not, I would rather cheap and clean than holding off on a change due to not having the right stuff.

The PT&T should use SAE-30. There may be sticker on the pump. You fill at the pump, there's a large slotted-head screw at one of the corners of the pump body. Put the fill plug back then run the PT&T up and down a few times to bleed the system. Recheck oil level and top-off as required.

Far as the gear oil goes, you could use 85-90W automotive gear oil in a pinch, but it doesn't have the anti-corrosive properties of "Hi-Vis" marine-rated gear oil.

You can run all of your manual-shift older motors on Hi-Vis, the only ones that would be different are JohnRudes with Selectric or Hydroelectric shift, which require "Type C", or now, "Premium" gear oil which is compatible with their electrical components.

You'll probably find the best price for Hi-Vis at Walmart, if you have one nearby. NAPA should carry it, too.

Andrew and I were able to spend some time on Sunday working on the Marlin. He spent a lot of time shop vac-ing the stern area while I was working on wet sanding the transom area. We started her up again, and while it is getting better I will still need to take them off and give them a good cleaning. Better do it quick as the impeller should be here in a day or so, and once that is replaced it will pretty much be ready for a cruise!!

Ed - Picked up some lube at Wally World. $12 something a gallon, I will post a pic to make sure I am on the same page with you.













Its getting there, but as you can see from the spot "shaded" by the speedo line there is a ways to go. I was just going slow with a piece of 1000, maybe I will drop back to some 800 and see how it turns out.

According to UPS, I should have my replacement impeller by end of business tomorrow. Assuming that is the case, I will be dropping the lower unit and tackling the impeller and a gear lube change. I was silly enough to mention to the kids that we might try taking it out on the Bay this weekend. Don't worry everyone - it will be going in by the cottage and I will have plenty of tow boats available to assist. That will be good cuz I haven't tackled the carbs or dirty gas tank yet!!!!

Before you get too nervous, I will take care of the carbs Thursday or Friday night at the cottage, and I will use a clean 6 gallon tank hooked up to the line from the fixed tank. However, as usual, I have a few questions for the gurus:

Ed - I went to Wally World and did not see a lot of gear oil. I picked up a gallon of the kind pictured below, but it does not seem to be marine specific. Did I grab the wrong stuff?





Gurus in general - the manual I have is for 1940-65 Mercs. Is there a big difference in procedure to do the impeller job on a 1971 1350? I will try finding a 66 up manual, but assuming I don't find one by tomorrow night I am up for some suggestions. Update - I was able to download a 66-74 manual for my 1350. I did not find a manual that touched on the 1500. The one on the site I was using had 1500 manuals for 74-76, but not beyond. I will post the question in Merc Outpost.

Got my work cut out for me the next few days so that the Monkeys are not dissappointed. I am sure that with some good guru guidance I will be good to go!!!

That's regular-old automotive gear oil, which will work in a pinch. If your lower unit has water in it already, not a good idea to use this stuff as it doesn't have the corrosion-inhibitors that Hi-Vis marine gear oil has.

I'm surprised you couldn't find any at Wally's. In my store they have a small boating supplies section next to sporting goods. In the Superstore about 10 miles down the road, all the oils are over in a different section in automotive. Some of the seasonal stuff they stop stocking earlier than you'd think, so guess what, it's already Halloween at Walmart and soon it'll be Thanksgiving!!

No issues if you're just using that gear oil for a run or two, I'd just check the oil after a couple of runs and make sure it's not getting milky. Any gearcases that show water in the oil should be drained & refilled before laying up for the winter, even if you don't get to the re-seal job until next year. The milky oil sitting in the L/U all winter will promote corrosion. Better to sit with clean oil.

Cheers.......ed

p.s. no diff in impeller jobs between the old 65hp and your 1350 or even the 1500. Just make sure it's in the same gear (or Neutral) when you reinstall the L/U as it was when you dropped the L/U!

Ed - I don't need to worry about using the gear oil in a pinch. I just wanted to get a gallon cuz I have 13 outboards sitting around the garage. I didn't want to deal with that a pint or quart at a time. I will return what I have and get Marine grade. I might end up buying a bunch from Fleet Farm - I have always been happy with that in the past. BTW - I did not see a brand called Hi-Vis at WW.

Dropped the LU tonight and posted some pictures in Merc Outpost. Doesn't look bad, but could not get the impeller to budge. I will take a look at the manual, but I was afraid to wrench on it too hard and mess something up.

I need to get it back together and clean the carbs tomorrow. Also going to change the gear oil. I have enough sitting around to change out the LU on the Merc. Really trying to get it in shape for the weekend so we can have sea trials at the cottage.

Wish me luck!!!!

Usually if an impeller is rusted to the shaft you have to split the brass center in order to get it outa there. I find that an old sharpened flat-bladed screwdriver does a great job of that but if you have a skinny sharp chisel that may work too. You just have to get past the rubber and onto the brass. Take care not to damage the pump insert or plate while you're working on it.

BTW "Hi-Vis" is not a brand, it's the type of marine oil, i.e. "High Viscosity".

HTH......ed

Thanks Ed! Last night I soaked it down pretty good with Deep Creep once I gave up on the impeller. Maybe tonight I will put the driveshaft in the vice and see if a channel lock will get it to move. Otherwise I will put an old screwdriver on the grinder or cut a groove with the Dremel

Guess I was thinking too much about the oil. I was thinking you meant high viscosity the first time you referenced it, but your continued references made me think it was some special brand. I guess I just need to remember KISS - keep it simple, stupid!!!

Ok - spent some time working on the 1350 tonight. The old impeller came right off with no problem. Getting the new one installed was a minor headache, but I think that job is done and ready for re-install.

There came problem #1 - with the T&T not functioning right, I quickly determined that aligned and putting the LU back on was not a one man job. Tried a floor jack and a ratchet strap, but no joy. The jack just tilted the motor up, and the ratchet strap didn't have enough oomph. Gave up and punted - sent a text to my buddy the mechanic to see if I can swing by his shop on the way up to sea trials tomorrow night. I am thinking that with two of us messing with the problem we should make short work of the reinstall. I figured that while I couldn't put back on the LU, at least I could change the oil....

Which brings up problem #2. Got the LU sitting on the drain pan with the driveshaft in the vice holding it upright. Took off the vent, and then took off the fill plug. Dry as a bone!!!!!! Less than pleased, but what can you expect. Filled it up to the top with new oil and will cross my fingers this weekend during sea trials. I will need to change out the oil after sea trials as I am sure that it will be dirty.

Started looking at pulling the carbs, but after #1 & #2 I was a little discouraged and didn't want to push my luck. Guess I will bring a can of starting fluid and a couple cans of carb cleaner this weekend. I will try pushing my luck with just fresh gas and some sea foam. Hopefully everything holds up!!!

Can I suggest a can of spray SeaFoam. When you get it running spray some right into the carbs but keep it running, keep doing that for some time until all the mosquitos in the neighborhood are gone. That will clean up the carbs somewhat and help decarbonize the cylinders. Put about half a can of the liquid stuff in a tank of gas.

Got a can of sea foam spray and liquid packed for the trip. I am not too worried about getting stranded. I am betting with how it is running that some fresh gas and sea foam will do a good job

I am more concerned with getting the LU back on and making sure everything is working right with it for cooling and lubrication.

Gee, I really hate to be the wet blanket here, but... If you just have one partially plugged main jet, you're in serious danger of burning a piston from a lean mix. Remember, you are not just starving it for fuel but oil too on a pre-mix 2 stroke. Starting fluid is also bad juju. It quite effectively washes all the oil from your cylinder walls, not to mention what it's doing in the crankcase on the way in. I know you're anxious to try it out, but I would at least pull the bowls off and clean the jets. Nothing you put in the tank or spray down the throat is going to do that.

SS - You are right about starting fluid. I have heard of people drying out their motors and seizing them with a lot of use. I am just giving each carb a judicious squirt for the cold start. That is the main problem that I have seen so far. Once it starts it idles well, and restarts immediately. I just need to get it to start on its own juice. I will probably pop off the carbs and give them a once over when I get to the cottage tonight.

I think that the fuel in the tank is a little thick, and I need to take care of that. Using the 6 gallon tank bypass will probably be the better call for tomorrow.

That is assuming that I get the LU back on.

OK - got the LU back on, and was actually able to drop the boat in twice this weekend for sea trials. Cooling was awesome, with absolutely no issues. Of course, sea trials are intended to locate problems, so I have a list of things to fix.

Overall, the weekend was meant to spend time with the family, and the kids made it up for sea trials on their boat. While we spent only a little time in the boat together, everyone got the chance to drive the boat - except Sassy! Nice to see the boat start on its own juice and make it out and back on its own power!!

Here are some pics:

First launch with both "owners" (the kids)



Grandpa minding the glass



The Mechanic



Ludicrous speed!! (for now)



"Owner #1" - Meghan



Sassy - making sure the hull stays wet



"Owner #2" - Andrew



Grandpa - seeing what $250 can buy. He makes 30 mph look fast!!



So enough with the good, here are the issues:

1 - Throttle cable is stiff enough to make me think I am going to break the control box. Motor linkage is good, I will need to pull off the cables and clean / lube them.
2 - Motor was dying when shifting into gear. Had to set idle very high to prevent stalling. I could use some thoughts from the gurus on this issue.
3 - No tach. Probably needs a new power wire as the original is just a few strands hooked to the choke switch
4 - Power T&T still not working. Leaking like a sieve, and probably needs a solenoid as "Up" switch does not work. This is going to need a rebuild of at least the starboard clylinder due to how it is leaking.
5 - No drain plug!!!! Needs about a 1/2" plug
6 - Steering is extremely stiff. Pumped all of the old grease out, need to figure out how to lube the control cable and/or take apart and clean the motor mount for the steering cable. Gurus??
7 - Trailer lights are dead on the port side. Not the bulb, wires seem fine. Might be an issue with the van harness....
8 - Wiring to gas gauge is suspect. Just a few strands.
9 - Boat lights and horn inoperative - horn wiring is not complete as there is half of an in-line fuse set up. Not sure about lights
10 - Boat winch has a loose cable with about a foot of loose cable stuck out of the spool. Need to replace it with a nice nylon strap. This was previously noted, but putting the boat in and out with this issue brought it to the boiling point today!!!

Mark, I would put that weekend into the win column. Time on the water, time with family, successful diagnostics.
You have your punch list now which is about 50% of the job. Some are easy peasy, some are not so. Disseminate to the minions

Cal - totally agree. I was happy we made it out and back without any serious incidents. Both times in the flurry of launching the boat we forgot to put in the paddle!! We would have been up the creek, and my phone was on the fritz this weekend. Luckily we put in at Potawatomi Park and the wind would have pushed us to downtown Sturgeon Bay if everything died.

The only big problem with the list is that none of it is minion worthy. Those are all jobs for me!!

We still need to get together for the eval of the next steps on the fleet. I stopped by the DNR and everything is legal for the water - even the GT, which won't be ready for the water until sometime next year. Let me know if you have plans for the game on Sunday. The improvements to the garage include a TV with surround sound, so we can work on the boats in between plays and watch the Pack trounce the Vikes when the game is on!!

I'm hoping the throttle cable or speedometer have issues, cuz that rig should run 50 or more at top speed.

Mark, whaaaaaat. the packs trounce the vikes, we will see. by the way nice boat. Frog. from minnesota

Kerry - speedo has issues, but I wasn't pushing it too hard. There are some issues with the throttle linkage on the motor being set to WOT, and the throttle cable sticks and is hard to get open.

Frog - we shall see what happens on Sunday night. I would really be "sad" if the Vikes lost the first game in their new house....

Spent the last 2 nights spending some time taking apart the control box and lubing up the control cables. It was incredibly stiff and I was concerned that something was either going to break or I wouldn't be able to cut throttle when I needed to.

Took everything apart in the control box and cleaned of the 40+ year old grease that was acting like rubber cement. Replaced it with fresh grease and cleaned and lubed the throttle line that was all gunked up. Working much better now!! Should be able to hit WOT this weekend!!!

Also took a few pictures of the wiring behind the dash. They are posted below, and I have made a few comments









Bottom green wire goes to the tach, and looks like it is hooked to the switch for power. The other frayed wire is for the gas gauge - which does work - but that is hooked to the choke switch. Does it matter which one it is hooked up to, or can I hook both to the same source?

Dem's some nasty looking wires! I expect things might work better once they're replaced.

Mark, looks fairly normal for the age of the boat. Good thing you carry a fire extinguisher with you right??
Love the picture of your son with the stone quarry in the background. Lived on the bay shore drive until '63.
SOP for me with any boat is to completely replace all the wiring under the dash. Most of them have been Jerry rigged so bad you need a program to tell the players. It's always easier to put in a small fuse/distribution panel to make things easier.
Life keeps getting in the way of our plans but I will make it over to your place sometime.

A trick a lot of folks in the performance boat community out here in CA and AZ do with the windshields that haze and crack is to have them wrapped. Get the outside of the windscreen wrapped in gloss black ...it will cover up the cracks and make it looks new. This works if you do now need to look out of the windscreen. My main boat is a 2007 Sleek 28 enforcer and the screen are $400 each....had them wrapped for $150 and they look better than new.

savvy - that is a really good idea. Maybe I will try fixing the crack first and if it isn't doesn't look good maybe I will tell the kids about wrapping it

Thanks!!

Ok - thought that I should take the advice and I spent some time taking off the carbs on the 1350 and cleaning them. I say a little time, because it was 5+ hours!!!! What a gigantic PITA!!!!

However, got them off, got them cleaned, and put them back on. Not exactly an easy task if you don't pay attention to the order that things came off. Finally got them on and was just finishing up putting the top on the bottom carb. Tightening it down, and it just kept going until pop!!! - it broke!!









Luckily a wise man, Ed, had turned me onto a dual carb from a 65 hp when I needed a part for the 110 I was working on. Went right back to that well and grabbed the part I needed. Put everything back together and it seems like it is holding everything together. Part numbers looked to be the same, but the gurus can tell me if I am asking for trouble. Seemed to be the same part

As it was, only the bottom carb was a little dirty in the bowl. Everything else seemed fine. Hope it ends up being worth the time!!!

Anyway - sea trials II on Sat / Sunday this week. Still need to adjust the idle mixture and adjust the idle down somewhat. Hopefully I can get that done Sat before we need to take the dock out. It will be kind of tough to tune it when tied to the dock if the dock has been pulled out of the Bay!

Hopefully everything runs well and I can have good running reports and 40+ mph speed runs

Where and when for the trials?
Nothing planned yet for weekend, might do some fishing up in DC.
Fella is picking up the pull toy Friday morning, driving from Lafayette, IND.

Sea trials will be up in DC at the cottage. Rileys Bay, and we might put in at Pot Park again if the wind and waves isn't cooperating. I ran out of time last night to tune it on the hose - didn't think that even in my neighborhood it would smart to tune the Merc carbs at 11 at night. Probably tune them on the hose tonight and then drop in the boat early in the morning so I can get it tuned in the pond.

I should be heading up tonight around 530 as dinner is at 630-7. Taking out the dock tomorrow at 11 if you want to swing by then.

Just give me a call on my cell if you will be in the Rileys / Little Sturgeon area - 920 360-0719

Got the Marlin up to the cottage and hooked it up to the hose. To my surprise, it started up right away and idled like a champ!!! I needed to back off the idle somewhat as it was spinning a little too fast. I am going to drop it in the water tomorrow morning for a final tuning at idle in gear. Once that is done, then it's time for ludicrous speed!! Probably not, but it should run a lot better based on how it sprang to life

I'm expecting mid 50s mph when all is well. BTW, what pitch prop does it wear?

Getting close, but still don't have it right. Better hole shot and it is probably running in the 40's, but it died while idling into the dock. Not much fun on a windy day. 17 pitch aluminum. I swear I can feel it bending when I hit the gas

I would have guessed a 21 pitch- Hope the tach works!

63LStriton wrote:

Getting close, but still don't have it right. Better hole shot and it is probably running in the 40's, but it died while idling into the dock. Not much fun on a windy day. 17 pitch aluminum. I swear I can feel it bending when I hit the gas

I went from a 17P aluminum 3 blade to a 20P 4 Blade SS MI Wheel prop and it was a completely different boat. Ran flat and a lot smoother and I can do an east 45 MPH before I run out of water.

If I get the chance and the time I have a 4 inch set back jack plate to get installed and then start trying to find the sweet spot with either this 22P SS 4 Blade.

Or this MI Wheel 4 blade Ballistic 23P

I think if you go to a 4 blade you will find it will give you more lift and ride smoother plus a little better steering control.

Karsten

Still driving what came with the boat. 35 is fast enough for the kids. Once I fix the trim it will hit the 40s

Sea Trials II went fairly well, found some more issues but making progress overall. Still need to tweak the mixture on the carbs as it is still idling rough and dying when idling in gear. I messed around with tuning it in the water and thought I had it good, and then no hole shot. Made it richer and then we had a hole shot but still had idling issues. Idle still seems to be set a little high as it is clunking when going into gear, but otherwise it is snubbing out. Even with the issues, we were able to have a great time on the water and I even got Meghan skiing!!

www.youtube.com/attribution_link?a=FkQMbkMpgEM&u=/watch%3Fv%3DjoA-m55V2R0%26feature%3Dem-upload_owner











Here's what I found out:

1 - I need some help tuning the carbs. Not sure if I should start from scratch again and dial them all the way in and then working my way back. I had done that after the cleaning and ran then all out 1 rotation. Maybe a field trip with Cal to do this with 2 sets of ears listening to the motor. Need to get it to idle lower to be nicer to the LU while still having a hole shot. When we went skiing I had to drag Meghan until the motor decided it wanted to go. But, when it goes it GOES!!
2 - By the end of the weekend I was noticing that it was not staying in gear at low throttle settings in forward or reverse. It was off the center / neutral position, but was slipping out of gear. Probably just need to do a cable adjustment at the motor
3 - Speaking about cable adjustments - while I was adjusting the throttle cable this weekend I snapped the cam bracket that holds the cables at the motor. Quick zip tie fix, but I should probably try to fix it to original.
4 - This was the first time that I had it in the water with a proper drain plug for an extended period of time. It was a leak somewhere as I was taking on water. The drain hole itself looks like a mass of silicon, so that could be the culprit, although I did see a fairly serious case of keel rub. Probably a fairly quick fix, but that probably is having an issue with my top end speed!!
5 - I took a swing at fixing the wiring on the tach and gas gauge. Now neither are working!!! Not really a surprise as the tach was not working and I did not reconnect the line to the gas gauge as it was originally soldered on. Might need to take Cal's advice and just install a panel and wire everything to there. At least I will know what I am working with.
6 - Figured out the issue with the trailer wiring!! It is a problem with the van.... Need to take the back of the van apart to look at the module and quick connect. All I can hope is that it is a bad connection or ground, otherwise I have a bad module that needs to be replaced.

Tickling this back to the top for some more Merc Guru advice on the 1350..

One turn out on each idle mix screw sounds way too lean to me, this will lead to hard-starting and idle-stalling.

The only way to get 'em set properly is warmed-up, in the water, idling in gear. Adjust the idle stop to an acceptable idle speed then adjust one-screw-at-a-time. Find the lean/rich range of each carb by turning the idle mix screw slowly in (lean) until the engine stumbles, then back out (rich) until it starts to run a bit lumpy. Whatever that range was, return the needle to halfway in-between.

Then move it about 1/8-turn to the rich (CCW). Allow 10 seconds or so for the idle to stabilize after making any adjustments.

Move on to the next carb, do the same thing. Then to the 3rd carb, same thing.

Once the needles are all set this way, they're all pretty much balanced-out. When any more changes to idle mixture are made after this point, all the needles must be moved the same amount and same direction as each other.

Now, once you've tweaked all three carbs, the idle speed will probably change, so readjust the idle stop as needed for good idle speed, if it's way high or way low.

Then do the "hole shot" test, if it bogs you're too lean. Move each idle mixture screw 1/8-turn rich (CCW). Let the idle stabilize then try the hole shot again. It might take one more readjustment, but by then you're 1/4-turn to the rich and the idle starts getting pretty lumpy by then. Hopefully with the 2nd adjustment the hole shot will be good. If it still bogs, you can try another adjustment and see what happens.

Reset idle speed, readjust the throttle cable, and you should be good.

On the jumping-out-of-gear, that's not a good thing and you need to get a handle on it before running any more.

The shift cable should be adjusted so that it has some tension on it, pushing into Neutral. You should be able to shift to Neutral, then to Fwd, and back to Neutral, with some repeatability. Spin the prop in Neutral and there shouldn't be any clicking.

With the key off and battery disconnected, have someone spin the prop while you shift to Reverse. The cable should go all the way to the back of the guide rack and the prop should move just a bit in each direction before stopping.

Shift to Neutral then back to Reverse. It should be repeatable. Adjust the shift cable if it isn't pushing far enough into reverse.

If adjusting the shift cable doesn't help, or you can't get it to repeat properly, there may be issues with wear in the control box.

Note that if it still wants to jump out of gear there could be internal problems which require disassembly of the L/U. In that case, you might consider just swapping-out the 1350 L/U with your 1500's gearbox for the rest of the season, then you can play around with L/U stuff in the off-season.

On the tach, do you have the rubber tach connector at the Fwd end of your control box? That's the best way to hook up tach wiring, Merc sells a harness that plugs into the box.

I've attached a wiring diagram for your motor, which shows the tach wire colors.

HTH........ed

Thanks Ed!

- I think the problem with carb adjustment is that I was trying to tune all 3 at once vs one at a time. I started them all at 1 turn out and then started messing with 1/4 turns etc., on each carb at the same time and then going from there. I will start from scratch and try to get them close on the hose before dumping it in the water this weekend

Just need to be patient (not my forte!!!) I was under the gun though as Meghan said she was heading up when I was sitting dead in the middle of the Bay after going for a test drive. That upped the pucker factor somewhat as I - 1 - didn't want to have to call for a tow, and 2 - didn't want to dissappoint my daughter.

- I don't think the shifting issue is with the LU - totally with the cable adjustment. Once it is in gear with some throttle it stays in gear, its just when it is less than 20 degrees either in forward or reverse that it is not fully engaging. I am sure that both the throttle and gear shift cables need some adjusting as there is a lot of free play in the throttle line before anything moves. i will pull it apart and make sure that everything hooks up right at the limits. Something is off.

- The control box is one of the "hidden" versions, and when I took it apart to lube the cables the only thing electrical that I recall was the neutral switch. Thanks for the diagram - I will look for similar one for the control box that I have and see where the tach wiring needs to go. I have one line going to the switch and the other heads in the direction of the control box / motor. Haven't followed that one yet to see where it is hooked up.

Sounds good.

BTW don't let the L/U grind into gear, you must shift with a smart flick-of-the-wrist to pop into gear; the shift dogs don't tolerate shifting slowly, as what happens is the tips (aka "dogs") of the shift clucth grind on the tips of the ramps in the Fwd gear, or the tips of the "dogs" on the Reverse gear. Either way it wears them rapidly to the point where it won't hold a gear.

Normally the remote control should first shift into gear then with a bit more motion, throttle-up. If it's not doing that, there's probably something worn-out or maladjusted.

I don't really like those flush-mounted controls, they are always a pain to work on!